Since my post on Friday, I've had a number of different people reply to me. And, I've seen a few other people voice their feelings and thoughts with most of them being helpful. So I'd like to share a few links to those, and then I'll say something that might bother some. Here we go... Some Insight and BackgroundRev. David Israel was the President of the Camping & Retreat Ministries Board in the Missouri Conference of the United Methodist Church for a number of years prior to 2012 when he handed it over to the current regime. He shares some wonderful background and insight/response to the change that United Methodists in Missouri are experiencing about camping ministry. His first post points out what David calls, "the idolatry of geography." Which is something pretty much all of us are guilty of at one time or another. You can read the full post here, but the gist of it is this: the campsites are just physical places; it's the relationships and spiritual formation that takes place that make them special. Basically, we should be more attached to God and people, than property. That makes sense to me, and it should to you too. His second post points out a little bit about how we got to here. He gives background on some of the other changes that led up to this point. It is information that I really didn't know, but is helpful to understand. He will continue to post and update his blog with his insight, so you can check it out. I'm curious to see his next post. FeelingsThe best post I've seen about the feelings that many have about this change to camping & retreat ministry in The Missouri Conference of the United Methodist Church is by my friend and colleague, Andy Bryan. You can read his post here. I know I identify with it, and I hope you do too. It's difficult to handle, but we will press on. NOBODY CARES, or at least No One Is WatchingOk, that's a bit of an exaggeration because some people do care, but Nobody Is Watching Us and What We Are Doing About Camps. This is Missouri. We recently had a big event happen (and activity continues) in Ferguson, MO. Our Governor, Jay Nixon, said that the whole world was watching us and how we handle it. Well, here's some news, none of the rest of the world is watching how the Missouri Conference of the UMC does camping and retreat ministry. I say this because some people have felt like the powers who made this decision are offending and neglecting the "Next Generation." The Next Generation is who we are supposed to be trying to reach; we all agree on that. No matter whether you're with this decision or against it, reaching young people is a top priority for the church. Here's the deal though, 90% or more of those people in Missouri who are age 8-18, do not know and do not care about this change. I haven't taken the time to look up the numbers, but I'm sure there are a HUGE number of children and teenagers who have never even heard of any of our four campsites. There may be a slightly larger number who have heard of Central Methodist University. But for the most part, we have only offended insiders. Somehow, we really need to focus on those children and teenagers who are not a part of our churches, but who are neighbors, and classmates with our kids. Most of these kids are playing sports and video games, going to school, arguing with their parents, reading books, eating candy, riding the bus, etc., the things that kids do. They and their parents are NOT offended by this because they don't have a clue. What's turning the current and next generation away from the church is their interactions with her (or lack of interaction with the church). We need to find ways to engage our communities and neighborhoods, and reach children and teens where they are. Don't fool yourself and think that this change has offended a generation and the UMC in MO has shot itself in the foot and all of the young people will go elsewhere. There is only a very tiny percentage of the next generation who know about this and care: the insider young United Methodists in Missouri. There's a HUGE number of children, teens, and college-age people near you who need to respond to the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Will you go?
Campers Everywhere
9/8/2014 02:05:34 pm
The latest opinion from the conference, "We don't care about you". Good luck with this approach. I'm sure all 1600 people won't be very happy with this latest conference view.
17 year old camper
9/8/2014 02:30:31 pm
Excuse me? Campers aged 8-18 dont care? We do care. Alot. Yes we need to get more youth involved with our church but how in the world does this have anything to do with camp? If anything it should get people my age excited. I know for a fact that Wilderness attendance was up 15% this year. Maybe if the conference actually promoted the camps outside of a packet sent to our churches maybe we could get more people! Oh golly did ya ever think of that? No? Not suprised.
Kate Schofield Beem
9/8/2014 02:36:50 pm
So interesting that you say this is inside baseball, yet you have no figures to back up that statement. According to the Conference, 20 percent of Missouri congregants participated in the camping ministries. That's one-fifth, right?
Campers Everywhere
9/8/2014 02:42:17 pm
I feel like I'm looking at some crazy person's Facebook page. I ask myself, "would I be proud to be a member of your church?". The answer to that is a firm no. Regardless of my stance on the camping issue, this was beyond unprofessional and an embarassment to the United Methodist community. Get it together.
Ben Mulford
9/8/2014 03:36:45 pm
I admit, I titled this and tried to be offensive to get a response, but I think my point is legitimate. According to http://teaching.about.com/od/ProfilesInEducation/a/Missouri-Education.htm there are over 900,000 public school students in Missouri, that doesn't count home schooled and private schooled children and youth. All of them are worth our efforts in our local communities. To say that we are rejecting a generation by moving our camping to a different location is a stretch. I'm simply asking how well are you reaching the young people in your community and are you deeply committed to it. Anyone who actually knows me, knows that I love and support camps, and I am still committed to reaching students. The just over 2000 who attend our camps is less than a tenth of a percent of the 900,000+ who live in Missouri. I just want to keep this in perspective. How are you reaching students in your community?
Campers everywhere
9/8/2014 03:45:11 pm
1 Timothy 4:12.
Melissa
9/20/2014 02:49:37 pm
So the UMC supported 2000 campers this summer, yes. There are 900,000+ children in the state, yes. Our camps supported 1/10 of those children (lets not forget some of the extra camps which the conference supports like the June camps at Blue Mountain), BUT how many other denominations had children and youth participate in their camps. While I like to think my denomination is the best, other would disagree and to me it is about making disciples of Christ so to have accurate statistics we need to know the number of children and youth in the state who did not attend a church camp who need to be reached for Christ because ALL Christians should be making disciples for Christ NOT their church. 9/21/2014 01:47:44 am
Melissa, you're right, we should be comparing apples to apples, and focusing on Christ and making disciples for The Church instead of just our church. I've apologized for the way I worded this post multiple times, mainly because most people missed my point. The point of pointing out 900,000+ students enrolled in MO Public Schools is not to diminish what camping does, but to show a way to truly "save camps." I was hoping to have people put energy back into their communities to reach those 900,000+ instead of having our fights amongst ourselves. Increasing participation in our churches (and in turn, camps) is what will "save" them. Also, growing our churches is not a self-centered goal. I realize you're working to include "all Christians," and we are a part of "all Christians." Therefore, if our churches grow, then The Church and the group of "all Christians" grows. I think what you might be trying to say is that we should have a deeper commitment than "the survival of our denomination". I think we do, but I know that all organizations have a "survival" instinct just like individuals do. Regardless of all of that, my hope is that people will see we have the same goal in mind: making disciples of Jesus Christ. Strengthening our churches and helping them reach young people does that. A local congregation has always been the primary place that disciples are made, shaped and formed. Strengthening churches, will strengthen camp ministry too. I have another blog post coming that will touch on this. Thanks for reading.
Ben Mulford
9/8/2014 03:52:37 pm
What does this have to do with camping? This change is one of many changes of reorienting our thinking about conference ministry: focus on improving local churches. We need to help local churches reach the youth in our communities. Its yet to be seen if this change will actually help that or not. But that's not what I'm trying to do. I'm simply trying to put your attention on building relationships with your community by reminding you how many under-churched (or non-churched) young people there are and how few our conference is actually reaching. Camps are a great benefit, and they will continue. But if our churches don't have any youth to send to camp, then we're in trouble.
Concerned Citizen
9/8/2014 04:24:02 pm
To those commenting on this post, take a deep breath and read the author's words. Your comments make me think we are reading two completely different posts.
Lifelong member of the United Methodist Church
9/8/2014 04:40:35 pm
The camps have been under pressure to be inclusive to UMC groups only. Outside groups...i.e. those we should be really reaching out to were questioned as to why they were taking UMC spots. Camps were asked not to make any major improvements, nor were they allowed to fund-raise for improvements. Even some UMC campers were not included in the finale tally of numbers because they did not register through the conference, they chose to run their own camping program at the site(s). This amounts to hundreds upon hundreds of campers not counted in what has been reported. This also does not include any outside groups using the site(s) because UMC's couldn't find leaders of their own to run camps. So if they were encouraged to not reach out, and to only self serve UMCs...how could they grow? The sites were asked for an assessment over a 10yr period. Immediate needs, 5yr needs, and 10yr dream list. These numbers are now being used against them. Most sites could come up with their needs on their own, without any doubt. I know 2 sites that could be self-sustaining right now. Being close to these sites has afforded me an ear to hear, and a shoulder to cry on for them. They cannot say much, because they are not self-seeking, but have a respect for those in charge of them, and those they serve. If 80% of the UMC congregations are in 20% of the UMC churches...what's next, to close 80% of the churches because they're draining funds and cannot self-sustain? Will only the big churches remain? And to what avail? And would something like this be able to happen as it has to the camps, behind closed doors, not on the conference floor, but by a few with a lot of control? These are some big questions about our conference. Where are we if we do not have a voice? The UMC youth counsels are formed so that the youth have a voice in what their groups do. Our camps have not had that voice in this instance. It was taken from them without warning. And now we cannot send our youth to a UMC camp. While using CMU is an option, what is it to remain in a typical college area, staying on campus, and call that a valid outdoor camp experience? Are bunks still bunks, no matter where they are? Why get rid of a true escape from society? Kids don't want to go to camp anymore? Parents are more and more fearful to send their kids away from home to unfamiliar church leaders. Kids have great difficulty relinquishing their electronics, and parents bend to their children's wills instead of parents enforcing discipline upon them. At camp the kids have the chance to be at 'church', in a Christian setting for 4-6 days straight. A community not met at a church building within the confines of a 45min Sunday school, 1hr worship/sermon, and 1hr youth group. Perhaps and usually all of which are inside. When Jesus wanted to get in touch with God, He left the trappings of man and went into the wilderness. A college campus is not the wilderness. And even the Christian colleges are still full of student bodies not walking with the Lord...whether we want to admit it or not. I am sad about how all of this came about. I am sad about how I heard about all of this. I am sad about how our leaders have acted towards their own. Most of all I am sad at what this may do to our conference. It is not they way to handle neither a business, nor to handle a church. The camp board alone needs to answer for their decision. Their excuses are misleading, and those that are new in the office are having to answer for them.
Shelby Dyer
9/8/2014 04:52:00 pm
Ben,
Michelle Cleveland
9/9/2014 01:57:46 am
While most of the SaveMOUMcamps brothers and sisters have pointed out most of the holes in your what I see as a fairly rude blog to some of your fellow Methodist brothers and sisters in Missouri, I would like to point out one more thing. You say the site and properties don't matter, it is the relationships and the spiritual formation that matter. What better place for that spiritual transformation to take place than away from the hustle and bustle of the urban areas and in a place where you can commune with God and see his work physically? I have read the plan for the future of "camping" for our youth. It doesn't make any sense to me that these plans would actually benefit our youth in Missouri to develop deeper relationships with Christ. How does offering more modern luxuries at CMU or creating "in church" camps replace the deeply spiritual relationship that our youth develop in camps away from these distractions? While I am glad the plan is to try to reach even more youth in all areas of Missouri, I do not understand how closing all four camps in Missouri accomplishes this. The conference has done very little to reach out to the Youth about camping, as it has been already pointed out in other comments. A catalog sent once a year is not supportive of that mission. The conference dropped the ball on our camps with their lack of publicity or advertising their benefits through outreach. A few years ago, I delivered to our children's ministry a testimonial of what the camps can bring to them because our church had no other way to let the youth know.
Ben Mulford
9/9/2014 03:22:08 am
You're most likely right about how numbers were or weren't reported. I'm curious to see how David Israel handles this in his next post about figures. I know that a person could make numbers say about anything depending on the interpretation of them and which figures are used. But even if the camps were reaching 20,000 among the four sites that would still be only a little more than than two percent of the school aged kids in Missouri. And the whole point of this "offensive" post is to see a bigger picture and realize how important it is to have vital youth ministries in our local churches. We probably have a church in or near almost every school district. So if we're going to reach this nearly one million people, our local churches on the ground are our best opportunity to build relationships because of their close proximity on a daily basis. That's my main hope from the post. I'm not trying to say that closing the camps is a good or right thing, but I will leave an opening that it could be. I'm saying a good response to use your grief and anger at this would be to reach out to the youth in your community and show the conference how much you (your church) care for students. That's how the future of camping will flourish because our churches would have growing youth groups. Someone could even be entrepreneurial enough to do a camp independently.
Tom Keller
9/9/2014 04:38:52 am
My question is, did they have to shut ALL the sites down? I understand financially the hardship it caused to maintain each of the sites. But why not look into closing just a couple of them down, and use those finances from the closed sites to funnel into the remaining ones? Of course I'm sure they have their reasons, and the more I read the more I can kind of see their argument. But I feel like they're could have been different approaches...
Ron Packer
9/9/2014 06:01:51 am
Reading your comments immediately brought to mind a scripture. 1 Tim 5:8 states "But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever."
Kathy Busch
9/10/2014 01:15:37 am
Ron - I have used this analogy to demonstrate the point you make in your second paragraph. When you receive your instructions from a flight attendant on what to do if oxygen masks are needed, they instruct you to FIRST - put the oxygen on your own face. THEN you put it on your children. In other words, you cannot take care of your children if you do not first take care of yourself. In this same manner, we cannot simply send our people out on mission if we have not fed them first. For it is when they are fed and that they understand what and why they are on mission. 9/10/2014 12:05:58 pm
I respond to both of these ideas (somewhat) in my latest post. Thank you for the thoughtful conversation. 9/9/2014 08:59:52 am
Ben, 9/10/2014 12:08:32 pm
Dave, thank you. You are correct about the two-fold nature of the church. The problem is we have put far more resources into equipping and caring for the body, rather than bringing more people into the body of Christ. My latest post speaks some more to this. 9/10/2014 12:11:13 pm
I want to thank everyone who was brave enough to use their name and identify themselves. I also greatly appreciate those who deeply reflected on what I presented rather than just judging by the title. I did that to get a response, which was probably unethical. I was too tempted to get noticed instead of just sticking to sharing my thoughts.
Bruce Blair
9/11/2014 06:01:34 pm
My personal view on this matter is that it is more serious than some seem to realize and may result in more damage than even the loss of the camps. Comments are closed.
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About MeI am a Software Developer, a career shift made in 2018. So far, I have experience with C# .Net and Angular. I continue to let curiosity lead me into learning new technologies. I plan to share what I learn along the way about technology and personal/career life. Previously, my vocation was United Methodist pastor. So in addition to coding, I'll share about theology, the Church and The Bible. I also enjoy running, music, and I'm a deeply committed father and husband. Maybe my experiences will help you. I know it helps me to share. Archives
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